ATI TV stops girder?

[Ron]

Have you downloaded the new group ? If so did you also get the updated sendmessage plugin ? Did you learn the events to the commands ?

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: RonB on 2001-06-01 08:59 ]</font>

[Ron]

I can't test this because i don't own a ATI card, maybe someone else could try this.

[JeffK]

Good grief, what kind of massochist came up with those WebTV hotkeys?

Anyway, I just thought I would mention that I'm using MMC 7.1 to watch TV via my Radeon 64 DDR with VIVO (not the All In Wonder, tho). I use IRMan with a Pronto, and don't have any problems with the Video-In App interfering with Girder. So if you're considering an IRMan anyway, go for it and maybe it'll fix your problem.

[Younes]

Surprise Surprise!
I hade the same problem before.
one quick solution is to install MMC 6.3
I also need to know what driver are you currently using with your Packard Bell Fast Media?

Regards
Younes

[Younes]

Did you try using WinIRC driver for FastMedia?

[mterlouw]

I have an ATI All-in-wonder (Rage), and Multimedia Center 7 works fine for me. It's strange that the DVD player works but the TV doesn't because they are both essentially the same app. There are two different export groups on Ron's site; are you using the one dated May 31? If you are using the older one that may explain why it's not doing anything, but like you said Girder should still move the focus around in it's tree view as you issue commands.

Mike

[mterlouw]

What kind of serial IR device are you using? If you're using a programmable remote you might want to set it to a command set that sends one-byte codes. Then there's less of a chance that your IR receiver can mess it up.

Mike

[mterlouw]

BSchuler, when ATI released the generic remote control interface, they said it wouldn't work with TV 7.0, you need TV 7.1. :wink:

Mike

[BSchuler]

Using latest ATI MMC, whenever I launch ATI TV, girder stops issueing commands. I thought it might be a Hardware conflict, but Girder strangley enough sees the signal and blinks, but no commands are sent. If I do it manually, it works, but not with the remote.. Has anyone else seen this?

Bschuler

[BSchuler]

No Ron,
I've checked and double checked everything. Here is the actual test I can do:

1. Bring up girder, and press buttons on my remote. The Commands jump around as they are supposed to and try to send the command.

2. Launch ATI TV, and bring up girder, girder sees the command (icon blinks), but it doesn't process it. It doesn't jump around at all. As soon as I close out of ATI TV, girder starts hopping around like normal.

3. And lastly, None of my usually allways active and working group switch commands work when TV is active as well.

So basically something is stopping girder from actually processing commands when the TV is active. Wierd...

Overall, if this isn't easily solved, don't worry about it. I am having too much fun with remote WinAmp, a slideshow program, and ATI's DVD player to worry about the TV :smile:

Everything else seems to work great with girder. Thank you again!!!

[BSchuler]

Mterlouw,
Yeah that's the wierd thing. Even the DVD controls won't work for TV because GIRDER just stops in it's tracks, and refuses to accept commands, so I can't even switch groups. I'm using your export group for SendMsg 1.5 (thanks by the way), ATI All in Wonder Radeon with MMC 7.1, and a serial IR device. ATI DVD works great though. TV seems to be the only dead spot I've ever come across. And the moment the TV app is closed, Girder goes back to allowing me to switch groups, etc... WIERD. And if I manual do commands, it works fine. So it is some kind of processing bug or something.

Like I said, skip it ron. The new ATI cards will be out in a few months, and we'll see what happens then with their TV. I know the TV on these ATI cards hog resources, and it probably is stealing something (memory, irq, etc) from girder, causing girder to break. I'm sure it's ATI's fault. So unless a zillion people have this problem, you should probably just skip it.

I'll keep working on it though....

[BSchuler]

Thanks John,
Well now I know it can work. What is anyones guess on why it would stop girder from processing? I made sure to run just the OS WIN ME, Girder 3.0.22 and ATI TV 7.1, and still no go. Girder can manually send the commands like I said, so it isn't the command. And I relearned the command code, minimized girder and still no go.

It is only the TV app that stops girder and nothing else (Guide plus, a seperate program that also has a mini ATI TV in it, doesn't respond as well)...so it must be TV related, no? Any ideas on what to try next?

[BSchuler]

I tried my second OS (dual boot system) and it suffers the same problem. I was hoping to avoid it, but I guess I should reinstall the ATI Multimedia center next and see if that helps.

[BSchuler]

Figuring this thing out...

Ok, I figured out sorta what the heck is going on. My remote works fine, except when ATI TV is open. Then it has a problem whereas every keypress results in a different code being sent to girder. So girder wasn't stopping processing, it just wasn't getting the same codes anymore. Problem is, the codes seem to be sorta random. As just an example, press power once, get 00083745, second time 0038456, third time 3495584.

Anybody know why my serial port would react like this just because of the TV or how to solve it? Sounds like to me a conflict.....

[BSchuler]

I'm using a (ahem) packard bell fastmedia remote. Not the best, but it has been working fine with everything else.

I think I found a solution to my delema.. If I make multiple commands and just put like 10 commands for channel up covering the 10 IR codes Girder gets for channel up..I should be ok. The commands seem to be specific per button so far. So wierd that the TV makes this happen.....

Last question to bug ron about though, Can I enter the commands manually to my .gir file? Below is an example, and what I think I would have to change per command:

[Keys]
enabled=TRUE
Identifier=580
<0 key>
irstr=247F237===Would change this per command
Device=7
Identifier=581
enabled=TRUE
ActionType=1
ActionSubType=1
TopMost=TRUE
Matchnum=1
StateCount=1
StateBegin=1

If I could manually enter them, I could use WORD or something to sort all the commands I get from the remote so I don't enter the same one twice or miss any. Then just make a temporary .gir file in notepad, export it, and import it into my permanent .gir file.

It could help alot and speed up setting this up. I could just copy and paste the same command and just change 1 line in each. So am I right above in only the 1 line I would have to change? Or does girder require more and I should settle for doing it through girder?

Thanks for all your help so far guys!

[BSchuler]

Last update on this matter:

I choose to use just Channel Up/Down functions and have ATI TV open maximized. Plus add in the 10 close commands needed to close the darn thing. Overall, I got about 50 commands now for just the most simplistic controls of ATI TV.

I felt that was better than 1000+ commands in my girder setup just for the TV functions I wanted.

Still have no clue though as to why TV makes my controller act that way. An IRMAN should be in my future..hopefully that fixes this.

[BSchuler]

Younes,
You gave me a ray of fresh hope. I deinstalled MMC 7.1 and installed the original 7.0 from Cd. Still have same problem. Will 6.3 work with a RADEON AIW? Also, is it downloadable, as the original cd my radeon came with only has 7.0. So am I stuck? I do have an original Rage IIc All in Wonder...Wonder what MMC is on that install cd. I wouldn't want to use that card though.

As far as what driver, I am using Com port 4, With girder IGOR SFH-56 Plugin set to DCD. Service unchecked.
Windows settings:
Com 4
9600 bps/8 bit/Parity none/Stop 1/Xon/Xoff

Advanced: FIFO enabled/Recieve buffer HIGH/Trans buffer MAXIMUM

Driver: Microsoft Serial.VXD 4.90.3000
VMM32.VXD (vcomm.vxd) no info
Microsoft Serialui.dll 4.90.3000

Running Windows ME. (NOTE: TV OUT is allways enabled in my setup, I have tried without it enabled though, and same thing)

Like I said, it works fine until TV starts, then whammo. So got anything else to try? I am open to all suggestions, I think I've tried everything I can think of. Like I said before, I am beyond giving this thing the boot and forgetting remote TV. Girder does everything else flawless....so I am willing to just stick to that...and drop the (small tear) Tv dreams if I have too.

[BSchuler]

John,
Yeah, with SendMsg 1.5 and the ATI export groups, you can control all aspects of MMC, be it TV, DVD or even guide+.

As far as the pal thing, I'm NTSC so I can't comment.

[BSchuler]

I started a new thread on this because I think the ATI provided genremctl.dll is the cause of the tv problem. I diagnosed it to the .dll due to when I reloaded MMC 7.1, DVD acted the same as the problem with TV before re-registering the .dll. After I re-registered the .dll, DVD was fine but TV is still flakey. So I am assuming, unless others can prove it not so, that the .dll may be the cause of all my TV headaches.

[BSchuler]

Infrared,
I haven't tried controlling Microsoft TV yet. So when I get a chance, I will try Microsoft and see if it does it too. I'm amazed I hadn't thought of that sooner. I will also check MS system resource meter and see what state my system is in when running ATI TV.
I thought that might be the case (about the MHZ), but it is wierd that DVD wouldn't hog as many if not more resources. Yet that works. To make matters worse, I haven't found anyone running MMC 7.1 yet remotely. So I can't rule out the .dll thing yet.
As far as getting an Irman, I am hoping to get one someday..but will have to wait for now unfortunitly.

[BSchuler]

Update: Windows TV works fine, so it isn't the GFX card itself just the ATI software that is causing the problem. WebTV doesn't mess up the controller at all! Problem is, it isn't GIRDER friendly at all (no keyboard shortcuts and can't catch commands) and is a very outdated program anyway. So even though it works...I can't use it, wahhh! I was this {} close!

WINLIRC driver? Hmm... I checked it out..and would rather not due to it looks like it could cause just more problems... but what the heck...I'll try anything. Let you know how it works...

[BSchuler]

Well, It turns out infrared was right. ATI TV does something to my system to stop the packard bell remote from working. I checked system resources, and nothing showed a major drain, so I'm still not sure exactly what is wrong. But it is certainly a system resource problem.

So, I ended up using Microsoft's Web-tv. Not the best for remote use (Microsoft doesn't believe in shortcut keys for webtv, nor does it look like it was even upgraded in the last 10 years), but I got a pretty good group made with most options. When finished, I'll put it up as an export group. On a related note, skinning Web-Tv seems to be a bit harder than I imagined...

[BSchuler]

WebTv isn't available for XP, or so I am told.

[infrared]

Okay, here is my opinion on the situation:

I used to use a packard bell remote (well I still use the remote, I just made a UIR circuit now). Anyway, the way it works is whatever program you use to control the remote polls the serial port and the computer has to decode the message. The UIR however has its own chip to decode the signal from the infrared remote. My guess would be the TV is using too much of the processor and girder can't decode the message correctly. How do IR signals work? It includes the time between codes or somthing from the remote right? Maybe it can't calculate the time to the same precision since the TV is using more of the processor now. I know I had this problem on my P233mmx when I loaded DVD because the DVD took A LOT of processor.. I swithced to UIR and it worked fine..

Jason

[JOHN]

Hi,
I'm using the ATI AIW Radeon and the MMC 7.1 and all works fine.

GIRDER can control the MMC 7.1 in every mode (TV,DVD,FILE PLAYER...) and zooming,moving the viewing windows!

Thanks
John

[JOHN]

With the sendmessage plugin can you control the TV?
And my guestion:
The PAL picture from "TV" or "COMPOSITE IN" is good to your ATI?

[rogerrabbit]

I am a real magic recever
Ati mmc 7.1 girder as blocked..
the receive as not longer valid ex:00863,08632,86325 etc ...

[smith-chris]

As long as you are stuck using WebTV for Windows, I came across these key codes at the Microsoft site. Perhaps it will help.
--Chris

Keyboard Commands for Microsoft WebTV for Windows

SUMMARY
This article lists the keyboard commands for WebTV for Windows.

Key combination Function
---------------------------------------------------------------
F10 key Display the WebTV menu
F6 key Switch between a full screen or
a window
0-9 Change channels
ENTER key Enter
UP ARROW or DOWN ARROW key Scroll up or down
Windows logo key Windows 98 Start menu
Windows logo+CTRL+SHIFT+Z Program Guide (grid view)
Windows logo+CTRL+Z Start WebTV or switch between a
full screen or a window
Windows logo+CTRL+V Turn volume up
Windows logo+SHIFT+V Turn volume down
Windows logo+V Turn mute on or off
Windows logo+CTRL+ALT+Z Increase the TV channel by one
Windows logo+CTRL+ALT+SHIFT+Z Decrease the TV channel by one
Windows logo+CTRL+ALT+SHIFT+F Left arrow
Windows logo+CTRL+ALT+SHIFT+P Up arrow
Windows logo+CTRL+ALT+F Right arrow
Windows logo+CTRL+ALT+SHIFT+G Recall
Windows logo+CTRL+ALT+P Down arrow
Windows logo+CTRL+ALT+G Pause
PAGE UP Increase the TV channel by one
PAGE DOWN Decrease the TV channel by one

[Valhalla1]

bump.. I have the same problems with Windows XP, ATI-all-in-wonder Radeon and MMC 7.1 TV player, and that remote control .dll from ATI

I use winlirc plugin with girder and neither one functions when the tv player is active.

webtv is what you are using now ? and this works with the ATI all in wonder tv tuner ? I wonder if that software works in WinXP. did you export a group to control webtv?

[Valhalla1]

so have u gotten the packard bell remote with girder to control ATI MMC 7.1 tv player ? my girder stops working as soon as u start the tv player, then works again as soon as u close it
can u export the group and email it to me ?

[stickboy3k]

*BUMP*

[gebus]

Well, I have been lurking here for a while so I thought I would register and add my 2 cents...

I also had the problem with the ATI TV tuner. Using Win2K, MMC 7.0, PB FastMedia reciever.

To solve the problem, I just created a group and used all of the keyboard short cuts for the ATI TV. I can link the group if anyone wnats it. Works great!

[rogun]

I would very much appreciate it if you would post the group. I've actually gotten this to work, but it doesn't work very well for some reason. So, if you could post the group then it would be much appreciated.