Universal InfraRed Transceiver support

[GoldServe]

Wykat's idea is a good one. I've lost track of all the changes done to the original. =?

[Lloyd Gordon]

I can't get any software to receive IR codes, either Virtual Remote, Girder (various UIRT dlls and firmware revisions) or the UIRT program/test software (versions 1 or 2). Everything was working before I switched to Xp. Any ideas anyone? Anyone having success with Xp and the UIRT? I'm using a 10 Mhz 16F84 and the original hardware (no 22pf caps or jumper on the crystal). Thanks for any help. I put this post in a new thread by mistake at first-sorry.

[Lloyd Gordon]

Xp can't be the problem, then. It must be something I'm doing wrong. Sometimes I get the "can't write config word" error, sometimes no errors when programming. I've found 3 dlls and five (10 Mhz) firmwares. I've tried all of them in different combinations. Would there be a problem using the JM PIC programmer with the IC-Prog windows software or PP2 DOS software for the firmware instead of the UIRT built in program function? I'll keep trying in the meantime.

[Lloyd Gordon]

Thanks for the help. Once I knew Xp wasn't the problem, I checked the hardware. I began to suspect the IR module. Luckily I ordered extra, I put in a new one and it works. I'm using the DP 1.2 firmware and dll and the receive part works fine.
Does anybody have any suggestions for learning more about PIC programming, dll development and maybe simple C for the PIC? As a newbie, I'd like to learn and be able to contribute. Any thoughts on books, free or useful software, websites would be appreciated. Thanks.

[Lloyd Gordon]

I also can't get girder to work with my Sony VCR or TV. I sent some codes to DP and he feels it might be a bug in his code. He says he will try to fix it when he has time.

On a different note, does anybody have problems with the UIRT (standard hardware) working intermittently. Specifically when Girder initializes the UIRT, the Vcc (often but not always) goes to about 3.46V and it won't receive or transmit. It will work within the "Settings" of the UIRT-dp action plug and also within the other DP software (config, RC, test and program) where the Vcc is ~3.54 (and the Vcc goes up with Rx and Tx). I've checked all the connections and components. I wonder if there's a problem with Girder and my motherboard/serial port. If anybody has any ideas let me know.

[Lloyd Gordon]

Sandros: see my post above. My voltages also were intermittent in Girder with DP dll. Sometimes 3.46=not working, sometimes 3.54=works. All other applications worked all the time. I soldered 3 button batteries together to boost Vcc. It works and the "off" current is only 1.7 mA which shouldn't drain the batteries too quickly.

[Lloyd Gordon]

I just installed the new 1.5 firmware and dll 10 Mhz. The receive function works with Girder and the Learn/Ir debug works well. However when I try to transmit either in test or by a Girder command the IR diodes just light up (not flickering as far as I can see) and won't turn off until I exit Girder (ASAP to avoid burning out the diodes). Any ideas? Do I have to install a 4 Mhz crystal and try the 4 Mhz code? By the way I'm "looking" at the IR using my camcorder. Needless to say the transmit doesn't seem to do anything. Thanks for any help.

[Lloyd Gordon]

Hi Jon,
I just installed the 1.6 firmware (10Mhz) and the girder dll. It works. I was able to control my Sony Camcorder using the test button. Thanks for all the great work. I just looked for the schematic you posted and couldn't find it. Also the 1.6 file seems to have disappeared. I'll try again tomorrow. By the way, I'm using an external 5V power supply (just a 9V battery and a 7805-pretty basic).
-Thanks again
-Lloyd

[Lloyd Gordon]

Aderusha,
Are you measuring the Vcc when the UIRT is in use by Girder? I found the Vcc drops from 4.95V when not in use to 3.46V when Girder or other software connects to my UIRT and it won't work. I gave up and use an external 5V and it works fine. As with yours, the programming would work without the external power supply.
-Lloyd

[Lloyd Gordon]

My (basic) power supply is just a 9V battery connected to a 7805 voltage regulator (Jon's circuit with no capacitors). As Jon advises it does draw too much power to be practical. I plug in the battery only when I'm using the UIRT. I'll switch to one of Jon's 5V solutions later.

[Lloyd Gordon]

I've had no problems with Sony remotes since I switched to the 1.6 firmware and the corresponding dll for girder. Since then I've been able to control my Sony camcorder, VCR and TV. Have you tried the debug function in the newest dll with the 1.6 firmware? The output codes should generally be quite similar for the same button.

[Flipper]

Jon, what needs to be changed on your PC powered schematic if I want to get the 5V from the USB port ? I built 3 UIRT's from the original design but with my own PCB, they all work flawless, but not on my laptop.

Since I don't have a keyboard connector but 4 USB ports, this would be the solution for me.

Greetings,
Filip

[Flipper]

Never mind, couldn't wait, I already found the answer: nothing needs to be changed :wink: Works perfect, power switch yet untested.


Greetings,
Filip

[Sam]

Hi everyone
I'm very new to this sort of stuff (see, I don't even know what to call it :grin: ) but I am very interested in getting my hands on an infra red receiver like this.

Is anyone in Australia working on this?

[Sandros]

Hi there,

I have also build the original UIRT version from Ruud. It works ok and I can send/recieve signals ok. The only problem is that I can't get it to work with Sony equipment. So since I have a Sony stereo/tv/vcr this is a big problem for me.

I am using a 10Mhz pic programmed with the JDM programmer, and have tried the plugin by Jon Rhees, which wont send at all (fails with No ACK) and the plugin by Danijel Pticar which does send to my Panasonic VCR but not to the Sony stuff.

Does anybody know what the problem can be?

Thanx in advance!

[Sandros]

Jon, I get the same 'No ACK' error with version 1.5 still using the 10Mhz version,
I'll get a 4Mhz xtal tomorrow to test if thats the problem.

Danijel, your RCV doenst work with my hardware, I dont know what the problem is I dont get an error, I just dont get any output at all. Your uirt-cfg10 and uirt-test121 do seem to work, but again they dont send, but also dont give any errors.

Hmm I think I found my problem my when I measure my Voltage over C1 it is sometimes 2.5V and sometimes its 5.3V, I think this is too low. I'm using 100uF 16V for C1.

What voltages do you guys measure? What values for C1 do you use? I know there is a modified version out there with an external power supply. I think that might fix my problem, does anybody have a link to it for me? I have tested the voltages on different pc's and got the same or lover results. I also replaced the 10 Ohm and 150 Ohm resistors with a wire now but that also didnt work...

Thanks again for all the help and the great work on the plugins! (if anybody also knows linux learn/control software let me know :smile:

[Sandros]

On 2002-01-03 06:28, jon_rhees wrote:
Sandros,

One other question:

When do you get the 'NO ACK' error -- when you try to learn a code or when you try to IR transmit. Are you able to learn codes, etc?

-Jon



Jon,

I get the error when I try to transmit. The learn function seems to work fine. I suspect that the voltage drops to low for the PIC to operate and so it doesnt give a reply anymore.

[Sandros]

Ok I think I'm out of options,
I have replaced the wire for the 10 Ohm resistor and the other wire for a 100 Ohm resstor, that didnt help. So I replaced the 10 Mhz Xtal for a 4 Mhz Xtal and programmed a PIC16F84A-04/P with either the UIRT v1.5 4mhz firmware or the UIRT-DP v1.21 4Mhz firmware and got the same results. I even replaced my TSOP 1737 for a TSOP 1738. Both the plugins seem to recieve commands but my VCR doenst seem to recieve anything when I try to send. I guess there must be something wrong in my schematic, but I'm getting tired of trying to find what it is...

[Sandros]

Yes, when I use the UIRT_4MHZ_1_5.HEX firmware and the 1.5 plugin, not whitin the settings window when I press test but when I test a command (F5).

[Sandros]

Ok I have had it on before and turned it on again now and now a test (F5) gives:
ERR 80 Recv'd from UIRT

what does that mean?

update: ok this is interesting, my vcr just responded for the first time. When I run the command about 10 times it responds once or twice to the programmed power button and turns on/off.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Sandros on 2002-01-03 22:40 ]</font>

[Sandros]

Jon,

I've never seen the string 'IR Command send' in the girder status, It almost always reads 'ERR No ACK from UIRT'. What is your baud rate setting in windows for your comport?
The repeat function is a good idea the vcr responds alot better now, i think you just made my day :smile:

Oh and another question, what do you think the max length for the serial cable can be? I'm not planning on having a pc running in my bedroom :smile:

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Sandros on 2002-01-03 23:10 ]</font>

[Sandros]

Jon,

This is indeed the case and I'm glad the hardware does react, although the errors do seem weird. I think its also the power supply. Eventhough I have had successes in the past with rs232 powered hardware, like an i2c interface for a ds1820 (dallas temperature sensor), I dont like schematics using rs232 power. Do you know how to connect an external power supply?

thanx for the gotchas on repeating ir signals

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Sandros on 2002-01-03 23:39 ]</font>

[Sandros]

Another thing that seemed strange to me with the 4Mhz versions was that the Oscillator config for the hex files is different. For uirt-dp its XT and for UIRT its HS (according to IC-Prog 1.04), how come?

[Sandros]

Jon,

I build the original design from Ruud using the schematic and not the pcb (build on a default print with holes everywhere, I dont know how to call it). The only difference is that I use 200Ohm now instead of 150Ohm.

[Sandros]

Jon,

Thanks for the great analysis of the problem,
now for a solution :smile:.
Why not use an external power supply, an adapter or if one still wants to use the computer why not steal power from the pc's keyboard interface, this is a well known solution.

I know its not as fancy as only having to plug in a serial connector and being ready-to-go but I think it would enable alot of people (laptops) to use UIRT. I agree that the in circuit programming option must remain as most people won't have a PIC programmer laying around (I know I did).

I wonder if my 'No ACK from UIRT' error has to to with the reception of IR signals during transmission...

[Sandros]

Lloyd,

Can you please put your external power supply schematic online somewhere?
Aderusha: I have also build the original design from Ruud with the 'normal' components on a protoboard, but as stated before I have trouble getting the ACK from Jon's plugin. I suspect it is the voltage drop.

[Sandros]

I've been having trouble for a while with Sony remotes. Today I wanted to connect my UIRT to a laptop and it wailed to enable the plugin (Cannot read first chr). I thought it was the power from the com port being to low.
Then I took away my serial cable and plugged the UIRT straight into the comport of the laptop, and it worked! Even de errors I got on my normal pc when I would send a command are gone.

Hope this helpes someone else too.

[Sandros]

Robin, thats correct it worked for a little bit on my pc but removing the cable on the laptop made the UIRT work perfectly, that is no more errors when sending codes.

Jon, I noticed on my laptop, if you don't have a mouse your not able to switch comport settings. Might be something nice to fix, I could only connect a serial mouse to the comport UIRT was on so it meant rebooting alot to get the comport setting changed.

[Sandros]

Jon,

I think you got me wrong, what I mean is; you can't use keyboard the modify settings in the plugin settings window (ie change your comport), so if your on a machine without a mouse this can be a pain.

[aderusha]

i for one would like to see this project stay within the realm of the "hobbyist" as opposed to somebody who has a pcb manufacturing facility and a hot air rework station handy. what makes the UIRT interesting is that the average joe like myself can order the parts and create the pcb without 4 years of EE in college :smile:

perhaps you might offer a couple PCB layouts - 1 tiny dual-sided surface mount version, and 1 bigger single-sided through hole version.

with the ability to run a cable to the transmitting and/or receiving LEDs in your design, the requirement for a tiny box shouldn't be as important as ease of assembly IMHO - the box can be safely tucked anywhere, with leads going to the LEDS which can be as tiny as you'd like.

[aderusha]

while i'm chiming in, i'll use this moment to ask for a bit of help with the circuit itself.

i'm having difficulty getting the unit to respond to anything other than programming. i've assembled the unit on a breadboard according to ruud's original schematic. i'm using the partlist provided by Richard on his page (http://www.caseserve.com/ht/UIRT/uirt.htm). i'm using a 20MHz pic clocked w/ a 10MHz crystal, per his suggestion. i'm using the PNA type IR receiver, which required swapping pins 1 and 2 from ruud's schematic. as has been noted on the forums, the schematic leaves RA1 and RA2 unconnected, where the PCB has them low and high, respectively. i've tried both without success. putting a VOM across VCC to ground reads about 5.05v, so it looks like the the rs-232 is providing enough juice and the zener is working. i've run conductivity tests on each pin of the DB9 to the far end of the serial cable to make sure that the cabling was installed correctly. i ordered enough parts to make 2 of these units so i've swapped out the major parts to see if maybe i fried something during assembly. i've checked and triple checked the connections, and had a friend look over it to make sure i wasn't doing anything stupid. everything looks right according to the schematic and PCB.

programming with the 1.3 programmer succeeds, while the older programmer from Richard's site does not. none of the test apps from daniel's site are able to communicate with the unit when it has been flashed with daniel's hex file. likewise, using jon's hex (1.5 and 1.6 - 10MHz) along with the girder plugin also fails to communicate with the unit. i'm using a camcorder to watch the IR LEDs and there doesn't ever seem to be any activity.

does anybody have any suggestions as to what i may check next? i have access to an (old and somewhat crusty) textronix scope, a VOM, and a serial breakout box. are there any testpoints i could be looking at, or are there any modifications to the schematic that i might try?

[aderusha]

if i am to power this circuit externally, should i just apply 9v across vcc and gnd?

it's getting towards 5pm here in michigan and i'm getting antsy to go home and work on this some more :smile:

[frdfsnlght]

I just found this topic today and I've read the WHOLE THING. This project is just what I'm looking for to add to my to-be-built HTPC. I'd be interested in buying a prefab PCB if that option pans out. I can build from scratch, but a PCB to start with is a nice option.

Anyways, I thought I'd chime in with another PCB option. Has anyone considered using the CNR slot found on many motherboards? I don't know the specs on the slot, but these thoughts came to mind:

1) The slot must provide power, but I don't know if it supplies constant 5V while PC is off.

2) It's a card edge connector so no parts are needed to connect, just copper on the PCB.

3) Does the slot give access to WOR or WOL? Maybe even a serial port (probably not)?

4) It would be a convenient mounting point for the PCB; no screwing or glueing to the case bezel.

5) The PCB could just include a bunch of header pins for attaching IR LEDs, IR receiver, WOL/WOR/power switch connector, Serial port, etc.

6) Hardly anyone uses the slot for anything since only OEMs have access to hardware that plugs in.

7) PCB size is less of a factor since your in a wide open space in the case.

Of course, you might be able to do the same thing with an open PCI slot.

Just thought I'd throw the idea out there. If I'm talking crazy, just put me in the corner.

-Tab

[frdfsnlght]

Where can I get the assembly source for the UIRT (not the plugin)? Is it available via CVS or on SourceForge or any other type of download? I'm toying with building a slightly different version of the UIRT and would rather not reinvent all the embedded code. Much thanks.

[frdfsnlght]

I've already looked at the 3 links (and many more) but I haven't found the _source_ for the PIC code. I have an old version (1.6) but I've been following this thread and it seems many bugs where fixes and other enhancements made. I'm still looking for the commented source (not the hex file). Anyone?

[frdfsnlght]

Woops. I actually don't have the v1.6 source; just the hex files. Where can I get the source?

[Wintermute]

Jon, Some questions, if you don't mind..

My UIRT is basically *stone* dead, and has been so no matter what I do :sad: I was using Ruud's hardware, and although I could get his own URIPRog utility to read IR, I couldn't get Girder to do anything. I got "Cannot read 1st Char" every time.

I just spent a couple of hours building your schematic, and was gutted when..... (you guessed it) "cannot read 1st char"

Here's the things I have doubts about myself.. any comments are welcome!

1) I didn't have any transistors whilst building so I omitted the 2N2222 and link to the Power Button on my Mobo, thinking I don't need this functionality just now. would this cripple the UIRT?

2) Rather than hacking into my ATX power feed, I derived the 5V Supply from one of the connectors cooler fans use to "piggy back" on a Drive Connector. (swapped round from the 12V line to the 5V line) is this good enough?

3) I don't know what to set the flags to for writing the PIC, so I have tried RC, XT and HS. Same result every time. what about the other flags? is there anything special I ned to set?

4) I am using PIC16F84A-04/P and the 4Mhz 1.6 image from your website. Is this a suitable part? my "original" UIRT used a 10Mhz Part, Can I just burn the 4MHz firmware to this part, and use it in your schematic with a 4Mhz Xtal ?

[Wintermute]

And in typical "noob" style, i forgot one other..

ISTR you need a minimum of TX, RX and ground for RS232, so I connected the GND from the RS232 port to PCGND on the schematic too.. could that be an issue?

[Wintermute]

Got it..

This is where experienced developers shake their heads... :wink:

For anyone coming after me buiding Jon's schematic, connecting TX, RX and GND is *not* enough You need to "loop" DTR/DSR (pins 7-8 in D9) an CTS-CD (pins 1-4 in D9) at the PC end.

Beyond that, I had problems with a dodgy .1u Cap across the 5v/GND lines on the TSOP, I resolved that by removing the component, and jumpering the 47ohm resistor.

I also had a flux bubble where I had soldered the power connection to the board, which was causing a *very* intermittent connection.

When I got my DMM back from a friend, things started to make more sense, I was able to step through simple diagnostics (power to PIC, power to TSOP etc..)

Thanks for feedback! (and of course, thanks for the excellent work)

Now, I just need to figure out how to send multiple IR sequences on receiving a single incoming event.. but that, of course, is a user issue :grin:

[Wintermute]

On 2002-01-21 05:41, jon_rhees wrote:
Wintermute,

Can you please confirm after all of your changes that you indeed need the Rs-232 loops you described?

I have not experienced this, and in all my designs I do not loop these signals. Perhaps there is some default in flow control I am not overriding in the plugin...but I would like you to cnfirm since I cannot duplicate this...

-Jon


Yep, strange thought it is, if I cut these loops, I don't get reliable working. If I cut the pins 1-4 loop, I get about 1 out of 3 fails with the "cannot read 1st char", if I cut the 7-8 loop, I get 100% failure.

I am using the Serial Port built into a Epox KHA-8 Motherboard, and Windows XP. The port is set to 9600/8N1/None in XP.

[gmarkham]

I'm sorry if this is a repeated question but the length of this thread is a little long to quickly determine if it's been asked.

Has anyone thought of making this a USB device rather that RS232? There are quite a few advantages going the USB route. The USB bus supplies 5v power and most newer motherboards have internal USB headers so that the device could be mounted internally. I know that philips has some sample schematics for a USB IR dongle on their site, has anyone investigated this at all?

Personally I would like to have a USB device that has IR support, LCD support and a few extra bits for momentary switches.

[bjoern]

Hi,

I've built a UIRT after Ruuds schematic, added two capacitors to the Xtal and an external 5V power supply to use on my Notebook as the serial interface does not deliver enough voltage. For testing I connected it to my desktop pc, not using the external power.

Everything works properly, on the notebook and the desktop, using Jons(1.6) or Danijels (1.21) firmware and plugin. Codes can be learned and sent, firmware can be programmed, all very stable and never behaving badly in any way.

And here's the catch: the above is true as long as i use the remote controls from the Nokia cable-box or the Loewe TV set. But the remote i'm really trying to get working is a Sony RMT-D201P (DVD-Player). I seem to have similar problems with the small Sony RM-658 (TV).

The Sony appears to be sending random codes of different length; viewed from Girder, up to six or seven codes (all different) are received when a single button is pushed.

I've also looked at the ouput of Danijels RCV12, and just can't make any sense of it. I can post the data if that would be of any use.

These are my questions:
1. Are there general problems with Sony or is it just some "feature" built in to stop me from replacing the remote? Should I just give up on it?
2. If not, how do I go about debugging this thingy? Is it something about the Hardware or am I just missing some simple setting?

I'd be very grateful is someone would send me in the right direction.

[bjoern]

No, i don't think they really are random either...but the unexplained and the random is hard to tell apart :wink:

I think the firmware having problems determining the end of the code is very likely, as the data doesn't make any sense at all... a varying number of codes for a single button press, all different in length and content...

I'm looking forward to the fixed firmware, thanks in advance!

[bjoern]

Does anybody have experience with IR-Receivers for different wavelengths? I am currently using a SFH5110-36 because it was the only one quickly availabe, but the remote i'm having problems with is 40 kHz.

I used to think that having a direct match was only important for optimizing range and performance but make no real difference in short distance. Is that correct or is everybody going aaaaaahhh now??

[strat_53711]

I'm interested in making a UIRT.

Would anyone be interested in selling me the necessary parts (PCB and components)?

Thanks,

strat_53711

[pz]

Hello!

I just stumbled upon this forum after trying to figure out how to make a IR transceiver out of a PIC! Man... if only I'd known!

Please bear with me as I'm obviously new...

As for my question: Has anybody ever done anything like this with a PIC16F628? The 20MHz version is cheaper than the 4MHz version of the 16F84, it's got more IO, and an UART built in! Would you even need the 20MHz?

Peter

[ego093]

Hello all! I'm thinking about building a UIRT to work with my system, but have a quick question for those who have a fairly intimate knowledge of the unit...

I'm planning to use this with my Dish Networks equipment, which happens to run with a 57.6kHz carrier frequency. Is the UIRT capable of this? Is there some way to make it work if it doesn't already?

I look forward to hearing from anyone with experience with this!

Chris

[ego093]

Ruud - thanks for the advice! It looks like "thunderbirds are go" for the UIRT for Dish Networks. I'll begin hunting down all of the pieces. In relationship to the firmware, though, I KNOW I'll need some help to get that going. I don't have a dedicated PIC programmer (I got married and all my EE friends moved away) so I'll be using the HEX codes to do it from Windows. If you could e-mail me what needs to be done on that end, I'd be forever grateful.

Again, thanks!

Chris